Legislature(2019 - 2020)BARNES 124

02/19/2020 01:00 PM House RESOURCES

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* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ HB 203 TRANSPORTATION OF LIVE CRAB TELECONFERENCED
Heard & Held
-- Public Testimony --
*+ HB 137 LIMIT NONRESIDENT TAKING OF BIG GAME TELECONFERENCED
Heard & Held
-- Public Testimony --
+ Bills Previously Heard/Scheduled TELECONFERENCED
            HB 137-LIMIT NONRESIDENT TAKING OF BIG GAME                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
1:46:00 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR TARR  announced the final order  of business would  be HOUSE                                                           
BILL  NO.  137, "An  Act  relating  to  the  taking  of big  game  by                                                           
nonresidents; and providing for an effective date."                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
1:46:28 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE TUCK, speaking  as the sponsor of  HB 137, paraphrased                                                           
from the  following written  sponsor statement  [original punctuation                                                           
provided]:                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
       House Bill 137:  Limit Nonresident Taking of Big Game                                                                  
                         Sponsor Statement                                                                                      
     House Bill 137 makes a simple  one-word change to state law                                                                
     to  help   ensure  that  Alaska   residents  are   given  a                                                                
     preference to hunt big game  over nonresidents during times                                                                
     of   shortages.  By   approving   the   bill,  the   Alaska                                                                
     Legislature would  mandate that  Alaskans be first  in line                                                                
     for the opportunity  to hunt big game  while still allowing                                                                
     nonresident  hunters the  opportunity to  participate in  a                                                                
     permit system for hunting opportunities.                                                                                   
     Under  current  law,  when  game  populations  decline  and                                                                
     restrictions to resident hunters  are necessary, the Alaska                                                                
     Board  of  Game  may  limit  the  taking  of  big  game  by                                                                
     nonresidents  so  that  resident  needs  are  met.  HB  137                                                                
     changes  the  more  permissive   word  "may"  to  the  more                                                                
     stringent word "shall," so that  the Board of Game would be                                                                
     required to  place the burden  of new  hunting restrictions                                                                
     on nonresidents when faced with a shortage of game.                                                                        
     HB 137 does  not change the authority of the  Board of Game                                                                
     to make wildlife  allocation decisions, and the  bill would                                                                
     leave  in  place  the  current  allocation  of  nonresident                                                                
     hunting  opportunities available  for  all  big game  hunts                                                                
     across Alaska.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE TUCK  pointed out  the Alaska  Department of  Fish and                                                           
Game (ADFG)  has attached an  indeterminate fiscal  note [Identifier:                                                           
HB173-DFG-DWC-2-14-20] and  a zero  fiscal note [Identifier:   HB137-                                                           
DFG-BBS-2-14-20].   He said  the issue  is whether  the state  should                                                           
have  a  policy to  provide  a  preference  to Alaska  residents  for                                                           
hunting opportunities when there is a shortage of game.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
1:49:03 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR LINCOLN moved to adopt  the committee substitute (CS) for HB
137, labeled 31-LS0879\M, Klein, 2/12/20  [Version M], as the working                                                           
document.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR TARR objected for discussion purposes.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE TUCK  explained Version  M changed the  effective date                                                           
[from 1/1/20 to 1/1/21].                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
1:49:27 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
The committee took a brief at-ease.                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  TARR removed  her  objection, and  there  being no  further                                                           
objection, Version M was before the committee.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
1:51:08 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MARK  RICHARDS,  executive  director,   Resident  Hunters  of  Alaska                                                           
(RHAK), informed  the committee  RHAK represents  over 2,300  members                                                           
who are  in support of HB  137 and [Alaskas]   constitutional mandate                                                           
for  a resident  hunting priority.    Mr. Richards  said the  primary                                                           
example of  why HB  137 is needed  is related to  the decline  of the                                                           
Central  Arctic Caribou  herd,  which  was followed  by  restrictions                                                           
placed by the Board of Game  (BOG), ADFG, on resident and nonresident                                                           
hunters.  In 2017, ADFG reported  the Central Arctic Caribou herd, an                                                           
intensive  management  (IM)  prey population,  declined  from  52,000                                                           
animals to 22,000, thus falling  below the IM population objective of                                                           
28,000 and restrictions were placed on hunting to sustain and re-                                                               
grow the  herd.  The  Board of Game took  action based on  bag limits                                                           
from ADFG  and set limits  allocating a  projected 43 percent  of the                                                           
harvest to  nonresident hunters and  57 percent by  resident hunters.                                                           
However,  the  projections  were   off  and  in  the  following  year                                                           
nonresidents   harvested  55   percent,  and   in  [2018  and   2019]                                                           
nonresidents  took  one-half  of  the  Central  Arctic  Caribou  herd                                                           
harvest.  Mr.  Richards pointed out BOG was not  following the intent                                                           
of AS 16.05.256 or of Alaskas IM law, AS 16.05.255 (f), which read:                                                             
                                                                                                                                
     (f) The Board of Game may not significantly reduce the                                                                   
     taking  of  an  identified  big  game  prey  population  by                                                                
     adopting  regulations relating to  restrictions on  harvest                                                                
     or  access  to the  population,  or  to management  of  the                                                                
     population  by   customary  adjustments  in   seasons,  bag                                                                
     limits, open  and closed  areas, methods  and means,  or by                                                                
     other  customary   means  authorized  under  (a)   of  this                                                                
     section, unless  the board has adopted regulations,  or has                                                                
     scheduled  for adoption  at  the  next regularly  scheduled                                                                
     meeting  of   the  board  regulations,  that   provide  for                                                                
     intensive   management  to   increase  the   take  of   the                                                                
     population for  human harvest  consistent with (e)  of this                                                                
     section ...                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
1:55:54 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. RICHARDS pointed  out BOG did not adopt  regulations nor schedule                                                           
a meeting to  adopt regulations that would provide IM  of the Central                                                           
Arctic Caribou  herd.   Thus HB  137 is  necessary because,  with the                                                           
Central  Arctic  Caribou  herd far  below  its  intensive  management                                                           
objective,  BOG severely  restricted  resident hunting  opportunities                                                           
for  hunters who  depend  on the  herd to  feed  their families,  but                                                           
allocated  nearly  one-half  of  the harvest  to  nonresidents.    He                                                           
restated  this  example  is  why  HB 137  is  needed.    He  directed                                                           
attention to the  [2019-2020 Alaska Hunting Regulations],  on page 7,                                                           
which read [in part][original punctuation provided]:                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
     Nonresidents are  allowed to hunt when there  is enough game                                                               
     to allow everyone  to participate.  When  there isnt  enough                                                               
     game,  nonresident  hunters  are  restricted  or  eliminated                                                               
     first.  If more  restrictions are necessary, seasons and bag                                                               
     limits may be reduced or eliminated for some residents.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. RICHARDS  stated BOG often does  not abide by  the aforementioned                                                           
statement,  and HB  137 would  require BOG  to do so.   He  expressed                                                           
surprise  by  the opposition  to  the  bill  from the  hunting  guide                                                           
industry, noting  opponents mistakenly state  the bill would  end the                                                           
guiding industry and would severely  decrease revenue to the Division                                                           
of  Wildlife Conservation  (DWC),  ADFG, because  the  bill seeks  to                                                           
limit nonresident  hunters who  provide funding  to DWC;  however, he                                                           
offered  to propose   many ways   to recover  any funding  shortfall.                                                           
Mr. Richards opined  the bill should have a zero  fiscal note because                                                           
BOGs   task   is   When  there   isnt   enough  game   for  everyone,                                                           
nonresidents are  restricted or eliminated  first,  as stated  in the                                                           
hunting regulations.   He  said Alaskas   wildlife cannot  be managed                                                           
based on  special interests, but instead  on doing what is  right and                                                           
what is  in the  constitution.   Returning attention  to the  Central                                                           
Arctic Caribou  herd, Mr. Richards stated  had HB 137 been  in effect                                                           
in  2017,  approximately  100 nonresident  hunters  would  have  been                                                           
affected, and  would have  had the opportunity  to hunt  elsewhere in                                                           
the state.   A  differing example  is of  the Nelchina  caribou herd,                                                           
also an  IM population,  for which BOG  has adopted  regulations that                                                           
there shall be  no nonresident hunting unless the  herd population is                                                           
above the  IM population objective.   He stated RHAK is  in agreement                                                           
with  this decision  and questioned  why the  Central Arctic  Caribou                                                           
herd  is different.    He  stressed HB  137  would  not require  draw                                                           
permits for  nonresidents in certain  circumstances, but refers  to a                                                           
permit system,  which could  be a registration  permit for  a limited                                                           
number of  animals, by  the discretion  of BOG.   In  conclusion, Mr.                                                           
Richards said  HB 137 is prospective  in nature and would  apply when                                                           
game populations decline  or restrictions on all  hunters are needed,                                                           
and nonresidents  bear the  brunt of  the restrictions;  not affected                                                           
are current hunts, hunt structures,  Kodiak brown bear permits, moose                                                           
permits, nonresident  sheep hunters,  and bag limits.   He  urged the                                                           
committee to review  the state constitution and pointed  out there is                                                           
support for resident fishing preference.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
2:00:42 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE HANNAN  asked for  the hunting  ratios in  the Central                                                           
Arctic Caribou herd prior to the decline in 2017.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
MR. RICHARDS explained prior to 2017,  there were twice the number of                                                           
residents as nonresident hunters;  resident hunters were allowed five                                                           
caribou, which  was about 25 percent  of the harvest.   Residents had                                                           
an unlimited cow  harvest, which was lost after the  decline, and the                                                           
season was shortened,  thus residents lost about 75  percent of their                                                           
opportunity and nonresidents lost to a lesser  degree.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  HANNAN noted  RHAK supports other  BOG decisions  and                                                           
questioned whether RHAKs   only concern is BOG  inaction, since 2017,                                                           
regarding the Central Arctic Caribou herd.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MR.  RICHARDS said  no.    Another example  of  RHAK's  concern is  a                                                           
proposal put before BOG related to  brown bear hunting; 80 percent of                                                           
trophy brown bears  on the Alaska Peninsula are  taken by nonresident                                                           
guided hunters,  and after  complaints by  members, RHAK  proposed an                                                           
early hunt for  residents to provide more  opportunity for residents.                                                           
However, due to conservation  concerns, biologists recommended season                                                           
restrictions and  closures.   Even though 80  percent of  the harvest                                                           
was by  nonresidents, BOG restricted  hunting seasons  for everybody.                                                           
Mr. Richards said resident hunters did  not need to be restricted and                                                           
BOG  should  have   limited  only  nonresidents.     In  response  to                                                           
conservation  concerns,  RHAK  wants   BOG  to  restrict  nonresident                                                           
hunters first.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
2:05:24 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE HANNAN surmised BOG  holds broad authority to regulate                                                           
-  with  direction  from  agencies  -  to  prevent  allocations  from                                                           
becoming  political decisions;  however,  there will  always be  some                                                           
unhappiness with  BOG decisions.   She asked  whether the  problem is                                                           
with one allocative decision or with BOGs overreaching authority.                                                               
                                                                                                                                
MR. RICHARDS agreed the Board of  Fisheries and BOG should have broad                                                           
authority   to  regulate   and  allocate,   as   board  members   are                                                           
knowledgeable and  trusted; however,  during the  last 15  years, BOG                                                           
has not followed  the constitution and the hunting  regulations.  For                                                           
another example of RHAK's concern, he  said BOG created new  must-be-                                                           
guided  species,  which  are in  conflict with  AS 16.05.407-408,  to                                                           
benefit guides  regarding moose draw  permits, that resulted in  a 50                                                           
percent moose allocation  to nonresident hunters.   He strongly urged                                                           
the  committee to  closely  review decisions  made  by  BOG that  are                                                           
detrimental to resident hunters.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  RASMUSSEN  asked  for  the ratio  of  the  number  of                                                           
licensed guides who are Alaskans.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
2:09:01 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. RICHARDS  said 88  percent of  contracting guides  in Alaska  are                                                           
residents.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR LINCOLN asked for clarification  of the IM target population                                                           
for the Central Arctic Caribou herd.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MR.  RICHARDS said  the  IM target  population  is  28,000 to  32,000                                                           
animals and  the population dropped  to 22,000.  In  further response                                                           
to  Co-Chair Lincoln,  he said  the  herd was  never part  of the  IM                                                           
program because  BOG was supposed to  direct ADFG to recommend  an IM                                                           
plan but failed to do so.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  HOPKINS asked  whether there is  still a  subsistence                                                           
preference after  an IM population  drops and a management  policy is                                                           
recommended for a herd.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
MR.  RICHARDS said  yes.   The IM  law is  specifically designed  for                                                           
subsistence;  in  fact,  all  Alaskans are  subsistence  users.    He                                                           
remarked:                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
     The  way  it  works  is  that  there is  a  hierarchy  where                                                               
     subsistence  comes  first,   sport  recreational,  which  is                                                               
     considered  us,  even  though  were  subsistence,  and  then                                                               
     nonresidents.   Thats   supposed to  be the  hierarchy where                                                               
     the  board  regulates hunters.    Look  out for  subsistence                                                               
     first, sport recreational next, nonresident after that.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  HOPKINS  observed   within  fishing  regulations  and                                                           
limits  there  are   personal  use  areas  specifically   for  Alaska                                                           
residents,  but  not  for  game,   thus  game  populations  and  fish                                                           
populations are managed differently regarding access for Alaskans.                                                              
                                                                                                                                
MR.  RICHARDS said  article 8  of  the Alaska  State Constitution  is                                                           
supposed to mandate a preference, but  [hunting] preference is not in                                                           
statute.  He said,   Many of you here who support  a resident fishing                                                           
priority,  but its   something else  to me  why you  dont  support  a                                                           
resident hunting priority.   It doesnt  seem to make  sense, its  the                                                           
same thing,  we depend on  those animals to  feed our families.    In                                                           
further response  to Representative  Hopkins,  Mr. Richards said  the                                                           
bag limit on the Nelchina caribou herd is one [caribou].                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
2:13:04 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE HOPKINS  surmised guides and residents follow  all the                                                           
same rules and currently there is no separate access for residents.                                                             
                                                                                                                                
MR. RICHARDS said  correct and pointed out caribou is  not a must-be-                                                           
guided species.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  TARR  noted some  members  of  the  public believe  BOG  is                                                           
influenced  by  the  guiding industry;  however,  some  controversial                                                           
decisions made by BOG are unanimous.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MR.  RICHARDS reported  the  decision in  2017 was  5-2;  he gave  an                                                           
example of a decision made for the benefit of a BOG board member.                                                               
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR TARR questioned whether BOG actions are appropriate.                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
MR.  RICHARDS said  RHAK  agrees  it is  important  to  have a  guide                                                           
serving on BOG because guides  are knowledgeable and provide valuable                                                           
information; however,  guides should not show bias  towards decisions                                                           
that  hurt resident  hunters.   Another  problem  occurs in  national                                                           
refuge areas  such as Kodiak:   nonresident hunters are  not required                                                           
to use  the permit  system that is  required of  residents; residents                                                           
must  apply for a  permit in  November or  December,  but a  guide on                                                           
refuge land  is allocated  certain  permits for  client hunters.   He                                                           
characterized this process  as a 100 percent guarantee of  a hunt for                                                           
nonresidents and a 2-3 percent chance for residents.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  TARR surmised  the  aforementioned  circumstances apply  to                                                           
federally managed refuges.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MR. RICHARDS stressed BOG has  management authority throughout Alaska                                                           
and allocates permits on refuge land.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  TARR  questioned   whether  the  issue  relates   to  guide                                                           
concessions on federal land.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR LINCOLN observed BOG  has supported reestablishment of state                                                           
managed guide concessions for over 10 years.  He asked:                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
     Whats   your perspective  on a  concession program  on state                                                               
     lands that,  rather than trying to  inaccurately manage take                                                               
     by season and bag limit,    having some more precise control                                                               
      in the form of, like, permits that would go to guides as                                                                  
     part of a concession area?                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
MR. RICHARDS  provided  a brief history  of the  problems with  sheep                                                           
hunters in  ADFG Game Management Unit  20A.  Over ten years  ago RHAK                                                           
proposed  before BOG  a request  that all  nonresident sheep  hunters                                                           
receive draw  permits; BOG refused, stating  that the problem  is not                                                           
too many  nonresident hunters,  but too  many guides.   Mr.  Richards                                                           
disagreed,  noting  that  the  Big  Game  Commercial  Services  Board                                                           
(BGCSB),  Division   of  Corporations,   Business  and   Professional                                                           
Licensing,   Department   of   Commerce,   Community   and   Economic                                                           
Development,  regulates  guides,  and  BOG regulates  hunters.    The                                                           
problem is  not too many  guides but unlimited  hunting opportunities                                                           
for  nonresident   hunters  who  are   required  to  hire   a  guide.                                                           
Furthermore,  RHAK   did  not  believe  the  Department   of  Natural                                                           
Resources  (DNR) was capable  of successfully  managing a  concession                                                           
program.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
2:20:57 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR LINCOLN  advised there  are negative aspects  regarding draw                                                           
permits in  terms of advance planning  [for guides and clients].   He                                                           
asked whether  a permit system, such  as a concession  program, could                                                           
more accurately control nonresident hunters in certain areas.                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
MR.  RICHARDS has  been told  guides  would accept  draw permits  for                                                           
exclusive guide-use  areas.   He described  problematic aspects  of a                                                           
draw permit system   pointing out  BOG has instituted draw permits in                                                           
certain areas of the state and  affected guides are still in business                                                           
  and further described successful aspects of a draw permit process.                                                            
                                                                                                                                
2:25:09 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
ROD ARNO,  executive director, Alaska  Outdoor Council  (AOC), stated                                                           
AOC  has informed  the regulatory  process of  game management  since                                                           
before statehood  and speaking  from his  personal experience,  total                                                           
happiness does  not equate with  the allocation of  public resources.                                                           
The Alaska  Outdoor Council  has 10,000 members  who, along  with the                                                           
Alaska  Safari Club  International,  oppose HB  137.   Although  some                                                           
hunters  want more,  BOG  was tasked  by  the  legislature to  decide                                                           
allocations  of   fish  and   game.    He   spoke  of   his  personal                                                           
participation   in  the   election   of  state   officials  and   the                                                           
confirmation of  appointees, which  are matters  of a  working public                                                           
process.   Further, AOC  supports the BOG  process throughout  its 40                                                           
years of  managing conservation  issues.  He  acknowledged allocation                                                           
of resources is  tough.    Mr. Arno said there is  not a large influx                                                           
of nonresidents hunters  in the state; in 1970, 12,602  big game tags                                                           
were sold; in  2019, 13,272 big game tags were  sold to nonresidents.                                                           
He cautioned that  the legislature does not want to  tie the hands of                                                           
BOG.   He  referred to  [AS 16.05.255.  Regulations of  the Board  of                                                           
Game; Management  Requirements],  which authorized  BOG to adopt  its                                                           
duties and  regulations to manage  for sport hunting  and subsistence                                                           
hunting as  needed for  conservation first,  and for  development and                                                           
utilization of the  game.  He opined there is  nothing in the statute                                                           
regarding a  special priority.   Also, regulations adopted  under [AS                                                           
16.05.258(a)], the only harvest priority  in statute, are followed by                                                           
 the  taking  of  ungulates,  game animals,  moose,  deer,  elk,  and                                                           
caribou,  for  residents  for  personal  or  family  consumption  has                                                           
preference  over  taking  by  nonresidents.     He  pointed  out  the                                                           
legislature  established seven  criteria regarding  fish, and a  1991                                                           
decision by the  Board of Fisheries was upheld by  the Alaska Supreme                                                           
Court in [Peninsula Marketing Association  vs. STATE, 1991].  He read                                                           
from regulations [document  not provided], and concluded  BOG chooses                                                           
from any factors it wishes and votes accordingly.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
2:30:52 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE RASMUSSEN asked for  the difference in the subsistence                                                           
definition as it is applied to fish and game.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
MR. ARNO  said he  was reading from  the allocation  criteria factors                                                           
after subsistence  and  there is  no difference between  BOF and  BOG                                                           
regarding  subsistence;  subsistence  comes  first, as  is  clear  by                                                           
regulations for BOG and BOF.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  RASMUSSEN  further   questioned  what  differentiates                                                           
subsistence hunting from sport or recreational hunting.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
MR. ARNO  said there are no  definitions for sport hunting;  in fact,                                                           
there  is  only   subsistence  hunting  and  general   hunting.    He                                                           
acknowledged BOG  struggles to mesh  subsistence law, IM law,  and in                                                           
some circumstances, federal law, to allocate resources in each case.                                                            
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE RASMUSSEN related some  Alaskans hunt regularly but do                                                           
not rely on hunting to feed  their families; other Alaskans depend on                                                           
game for  food and survival; guides  rely on hunting  by nonresidents                                                           
to  earn  their living.    She  said  all  Alaskans should  have  the                                                           
opportunity to provide  for their families and inquired as  to how to                                                           
differentiate from three alternate methods to do so.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MR. ARNO  said the  state provides a  $5.00 low-income  license which                                                           
may help  to identify  subsistence  users, of  which 7,000 come  from                                                           
urban  areas;  another 13,000  come  from  [rural] areas,  and  these                                                           
numbers could be  one criterion.  Further, 6,000 Alaskans  get a free                                                           
license because  of their old age.   He said the  [differing factors]                                                           
cannot  be racial  or,  because of  [the  1989  Alaska Supreme  Court                                                           
decision in McDowell  v. STATE], based on the  location of residency;                                                           
however,  federal  law   grants  a  priority  on   federal  land  for                                                           
harvesting  fish and  game after  one year  of residence.   Mr.  Arno                                                           
argued the guide  industry and nonresidents are not  taking game meat                                                           
away  from   Alaskan  subsistence   users,  based  on   his  personal                                                           
experience that moose  and caribou meat [taken  by nonresident trophy                                                           
hunters] is distributed to local communities.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  LINCOLN directed  attention  to AS  16.05.258 (4)(B)  which                                                           
read:                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
     (B) distinguish among subsistence users, through                                                                         
     limitations based on                                                                                                       
          (i) the customary and direct dependence on the                                                                      
     fish stock or game population by the subsistence user                                                                      
     for human consumption as a mainstay of livelihood;                                                                         
          (ii) the proximity of the domicile of the                                                                           
     subsistence user to the stock or population; and                                                                           
          (iii) the ability of the subsistence user to                                                                        
     obtain food if subsistence use is restricted or                                                                            
     eliminated.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  LINCOLN  said  state   law  distinguishes  that  the  broad                                                           
category  of subsistence  users includes  some Alaskans  who rely  on                                                           
subsistence more  than others  due to their  location and  ability to                                                           
obtain food.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. ARNO pointed out no has defined mainstay of livelihood.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  LINCOLN asked  if Mr.  Arno agreed  with the  facts of  the                                                           
population and resident and nonresident  hunting quotas regarding the                                                           
Central Arctic  Caribou herd  during 2016-2019,  as presented  by Mr.                                                           
Richards.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
MR.  ARNO   said  the  appointed   [BOG]  board   members  thoroughly                                                           
deliberate  issues such  as accessibility,  and in  [the case of  the                                                           
Central  Arctic  Caribou  herd]  made  a  decision  about  continuing                                                           
opportunities  for nonresident  hunters  because  BOG has  sufficient                                                           
leeway; he  cautioned against the bill   tying the hands  of  BOG and                                                           
forcing board members to make certain decisions.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR LINCOLN restated  his question about the accuracy  of the IM                                                           
population  level  of the  Central  Arctic  Caribou herd  at  28,000-                                                           
32,000.                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
MR. ARNO responded:                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
     Absolutely,  and  those  numbers  are  just as  made  up  as                                                               
     anything  else that  we  work  on based  on  past  data, but                                                               
     theres   plenty of  other factors  as to  what  the carrying                                                               
     capacity  is, the  habitat  is at  that time  and  those are                                                               
     factors  that  come to  that  board.    So  when, you  know,                                                               
     theyre   looking at  that  and want  to get  that  herd, you                                                               
     know, built back  up, and do what  they can, cause intensive                                                               
     management  then  requires the  board  to  look at  control,                                                               
     predator  control  programs,  so  as  much  as a  factor  as                                                               
     anything  else   they  have to  look about  the funding.   I                                                               
     mean,  can they  actually  pull it  off  if they  put  it in                                                               
     intensive management ?                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  LINCOLN  pointed  out  his   question  relates  to  a  game                                                           
population  that was  critical for  subsistence users,  and that  was                                                           
well under  established IM populations  - and one would  expect there                                                           
would  have been  an  effort to  revive the  population  - yet  40-50                                                           
percent of  the take was by nonresident  hunters.  He asked  if these                                                           
circumstances were inherently out of balance.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
2:41:55 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. ARNO  opined the decision  was not any  more out of  balance than                                                           
numerous other BOG decisions that were  based on its criteria and the                                                           
board process.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR LINCOLN  said,  I wasnt  asking  if it was more  or less out                                                           
of balance  than other decisions.  ... That doesnt   seem problematic                                                           
to you, that, you know, half the take was from nonresident hunters?                                                             
                                                                                                                                
MR. ARNO said he couldnt answer the question further.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE HANNAN  recalled there is  a mid-winter moose  hunt in                                                           
Lower Yukon that  is not utilized by guided trophy  hunters and asked                                                           
whether  there  are  similar  winter hunts  that  garner  99  percent                                                           
resident hunters.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
MR. ARNO said he couldnt answer.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
2:44:06 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR TARR opened public testimony on HB 137.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
2:44:48 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
SAM  ROHRER,  president,  Alaska   Professional  Hunters  Association                                                           
(APHA), informed  the committee  he is a  lifelong Alaskan  living on                                                           
Kodiak Island  and has been  a hunting guide for  21 years.   He said                                                           
APHA  opposes HB  137;  APHA has  represented  the  big game  guiding                                                           
industry  in Alaska  for  over 50  years.   Big  game  guiding is  an                                                           
honorable and  historical profession  in Alaska  and is  the original                                                           
value-added  tourism  industry in  Alaska  that is  approximately  90                                                           
percent Alaskan-owned.  Many guides live  in rural Alaska and over 50                                                           
percent  of $52  million in  guiding  income stays  in rural  Alaska;                                                           
APHAs  mission is to support the  conservation of wildlife in Alaska,                                                           
enhance the value of Alaskas   wildlife resources, and to sustainably                                                           
provide  jobs  and income  for  guiding  businesses.   He  said  APHA                                                           
opposes HB  137 for several reasons:   the bill would  reduce funding                                                           
for wildlife conservation because  nonresident hunters represent less                                                           
than 13 percent of  hunters and pay 72 percent of   the bill  through                                                           
license fees  and tags;  if HB  137 were  to pass,  there would  be a                                                           
large drop  in nonresident  opportunity and a  large drop  in license                                                           
and tag fees.  In addition, BOG  currently has the ability to promote                                                           
resident priority  by adjusting seasons, limiting methods  and means,                                                           
imposing  a  subsistence  priority  and  controlled  use  areas,  and                                                           
implementing draw hunts  if necessary.  Mr. Rohrer said  HB 137 would                                                           
force BOG  to instead mandate  a hunt  structure most harmful  to the                                                           
guide industry  and that  would reduce  funding for  conservation, be                                                           
harmful to  small guide  businesses, and  wont  work.   He  urged the                                                           
committee to oppose the bill.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
2:47:23 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  TUCK observed  BOG has various  options [when  making                                                           
its decisions];  he noted the bill  [makes a change in  statute] from                                                           
 may   to  shall,   but surmised  BOG  could establish  some sort  of                                                           
preference on very a minimal level.                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
MR.  ROHRER  explained HB  137  would  require  BOG to  review  every                                                           
hunting regulation  and to  define  reasonable  resident opportunity                                                            
for  each hunting  season  and bag  limit.    Currently, BOG  reviews                                                           
individual  proposals  and  uses  many options,  such  as  shortening                                                           
seasons, in response.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  RASMUSSEN  asked  when  nonresidents  typically  book                                                           
guides and hunts.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
MR. ROHRER said  clients book well-known operators two  to four years                                                           
in advance; most hunters book more than one year in advance.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  LINCOLN asked  for  a breakdown,  by  species, relative  to                                                           
guiding operations, revenue to guides, and revenue to the state.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
2:50:51 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. ROHRER offered to provide an  economic study.  In response to Co-                                                           
Chair Lincolns   earlier question  about the  Central Arctic  Caribou                                                           
herd,  he gave  an example that  if 50  percent of  an allocation  is                                                           
going to  nonresidents, it is not  because of an  allocation decision                                                           
by BOG,  but because the  hunts are open  to all hunters   and thats                                                            
just who is showing up, but other  people can show up for it as well,                                                           
other residents.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  LINCOLN  recognized BOG  uses  many options;  however,  its                                                           
decision  [on the  Central  Arctic Caribou  herd]  was  based upon  a                                                           
projection of 40 percent.  He remarked:                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
     I imagine when theyre   going through their deliberations on                                                               
     the tools that  they do have, that they  have some of target                                                               
     in mind,  some sort  of   a  projection that wasnt   met and                                                               
     that in  fact, the majority of  the animals taken  at a time                                                               
     where  the population  was  substantially less  than  the IM                                                               
     target.   The  point of that question is  trying to get at                                                                 
     if a there  is a game population at  that level, under that,                                                               
     that level  of stress,  and its   as important  as it  is to                                                               
     Alaskans, for their  food, does it strike  you as being like                                                               
     a  reasonable  balanced  sort  of  distribution, if  not  an                                                               
     allocation, its  still a  projection around 40-45 percent of                                                               
     the take  goes to nonresidents    as an Alaskan,  how do you                                                               
     feel about that?                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MR.  ROHRER  acknowledged  the aforementioned  numbers  didnt   sound                                                           
good; however,  one must look at  the location of the hunt  area, who                                                           
is participating,  whether there  are villages  nearby, and  what the                                                           
means of access are, all of which  would  shed some light  on why the                                                           
[Central Arctic Caribou herd] nonresident number is so high.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  RASMUSSEN reported  230,000 pounds  of game meat  was                                                           
shared with Alaska residents in  2015 from guided nonresident hunters                                                           
[document not provided].                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
2:56:39 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
SAM  FEJES expressed  his opposition  to HB  137.   He said  he is  a                                                           
lifelong Alaskan  with three children  and is a commercial  pilot and                                                           
holds a  master U.S. Coast  Guard license.   Mr. Fejes has  served on                                                           
the APHA board  of directors for nine years and holds  a master guide                                                           
license.  Currently, Mr. Fejes operates  two lodges, one near Yakutat                                                           
and one  on Kodiak  Island,  and he has  been guiding  for 39  years.                                                           
Further,  he is  one of  three guides  in  Alaska who  applied for  a                                                           
commercial guide  lease in 1986;  the guide lease process  required a                                                           
substantial investment  in his  property.   Mr. Fejes  provided brief                                                           
personal background.   As a professional  guide, he has  clients from                                                           
all walks  of life  and noted the  most important  is the  client who                                                           
saves all his life  to go hunting or fishing in  Alaska.  All clients                                                           
are appreciative  of the beauty of  Alaska and how the  state manages                                                           
its resources.  He said HB 137  would most likely end his profession,                                                           
lead  to a  downturn  in tourism,  and  reduce  funding for  wildlife                                                           
management programs.  He said the  BOG process works and restated his                                                           
opposition to the bill.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR LINCOLN inquired as to the species guided by Mr. Fejes.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MR. FEJES said he guides fishing,  hunting, ecotourism, and all kinds                                                           
of tourism.  In summer, he operates  a fishing and bear viewing lodge                                                           
in Kodiak;  in fall  and spring he  guides hunting  and fishing.   In                                                           
further response  to Co-Chair  Lincoln, he said  the big  game hunted                                                           
are moose, brown bear, goat, and black bear.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  LINCOLN questioned  whether  any of  the  big game  animals                                                           
currently fall under any hunting restrictions.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
MR. FEJES  said in  some areas there  are restrictions.   He  said he                                                           
conducts  surveys of  goat,  moose,  and fish  for  the  state.   For                                                           
example, goat  surveys can cover 100  miles in one day;  and from the                                                           
extensive counts, biologists determine how  many animals can be taken                                                           
in  specific  areas.   He  pointed  out  hunting  areas are  open  to                                                           
resident  and   nonresident  hunters;  however,  in   certain  areas,                                                           
resident hunters are seldom found.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
3:02:55 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE TUCK stressed  the bill only applies in  times of game                                                           
shortages;  he  asked  how  the  bill would  put  Mr.  Fejes  out  of                                                           
business.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
MR. FEJES opined  resources belong to everyone,  including those from                                                           
outside Alaska.   Returning to  Representative Tucks   question about                                                           
the  effect of  [a change  from  may   to   shall],  he  said he  has                                                           
learned to voice  his opinion.  Moose were  transplanted  down there                                                            
in the  '50s and now there  is a big  herd with a lot  of subsistence                                                           
hunters.   He expressed  his belief subsistence  should be  for those                                                           
who  live off  the  land and  not  for those  who  use their  $40,000                                                           
airboat to hunt moose.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
3:05:49 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
HB 137 was held over with public testimony open.                                                                                

Document Name Date/Time Subjects
HB 203 1.21.20.PDF HFSH 1/30/2020 11:00:00 AM
HFSH 2/4/2020 11:00:00 AM
HRES 2/19/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 2/21/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 203
HB 203 CS(FSH) v. U 2.5.20.PDF HRES 2/19/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 2/21/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 203
HB 203 Sponsor Statement 2.5.2020.pdf HRES 2/19/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 2/21/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 203
HB 203 Fiscal Note 1 - DFG-DCF 2.5.2020.PDF HRES 2/19/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 2/21/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 203
HB 203 Fiscal Note 2 - DPS-AWT 2.5.2020.PDF HRES 2/19/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 2/21/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 203
HB 203 HFSH Testimony 2.6.2020.pdf HRES 2/19/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 2/21/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 203
HB 203 Testimony Recieved by 1.29.20.pdf HFSH 1/30/2020 11:00:00 AM
HFSH 2/4/2020 11:00:00 AM
HRES 2/19/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 2/21/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 203
HB 137 Sponsor Statement 2.10.2020.pdf HRES 2/19/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 2/21/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 137
HB 137 v. A.PDF HRES 2/19/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 2/21/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 137
HB 137 Sectional Analysis v. A 2.10.2020.pdf HRES 2/19/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 2/21/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 137
HB 137 Resident Hunters of Alaska White Paper.pdf HRES 2/19/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 2/21/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 137
HB 137 Work Draft CS v. M 2.12.20.pdf HRES 2/19/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 2/21/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 137
HB 137 Fiscal Note - DFG-DWC 2.14.20.pdf HRES 2/19/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 2/21/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 137
HB 137 Fiscal Note - DFG-BBS 2.14.20.pdf HRES 2/19/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 2/21/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 137
HB 203 DEC Note 2.5.2020.pdf HRES 2/19/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 2/21/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 203
HB 203 HRES Testimony 2.19.2020.pdf HRES 2/19/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 2/21/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 203
HB 137 Testimony as of 2.18.2020.pdf HRES 2/19/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 2/21/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 137